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Episode #463: LIVE from the Creative Business Models for Accountants Conference

This week Ron and Ed traveled to Miami to attend Hector Garcia's Creative Business Models for Accountants Conference where they shared their thoughts about Day 1 of the conference live with the audience. Then they took questions from the attendees in classic "Ask Us Anything" style.

This show was LIVE and featured a series of great questions from the audience. Here is the AI generated overview but you definitely want to listen to the show to capture the audience excitement.

  • Business model innovation at Creative Business Model Counties

  • Consulting and questioning techniques in business

  • The importance of asking "what matters" questions in innovation

  • How to handle objections and questions from clients.

  • Framing questions for a historical document.

  • Creativity and comfort for accountants at a conference.

  • Business models, branding, and AI in the professional services industry.

  • Retraining the brain to think in questions, not solutions

  • The importance of asking the right questions in business

  • Asking better questions for personal growth and success.

  • Creative business models for accountants with Q&A.

  • Moving away from solution-focused thinking in sales

  • Providing valuable insights through active listening and pivoting

  • The accounting profession's talent crisis and outdated business model

  • The future of accounting and billing models

  • Making accounting a cool profession

  • Using humor to revitalize the accounting profession

  • Subscription-based business models and potential obstacles

  • Pricing strategy and mindset for subscription-based businesses

  • Business models and customer lifetime value

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #462: The Techno-Optimist Manifesto by Marc Andreessen

Ed and Ron explored Marc Andresseen's "The Techno-Optimist Manifesto." It's a thought-provoking piece that we largely agree with. You can find the Manifesto at: https://a16z.com/the-techno-optimist-manifesto/

Use these show notes to follow along with audio…

Segment one:

  • Take the economics of our show over the last 9.5 hours and boil it down into one thing. What do you get? The Techno-Optimist Manifesto at this link: https://a16z.com/the-techno-optimist-manifesto/ 

  • The Techno-Optimist Manifesto reminds Ron of Virginia Postrel and her book, “The FUTURE AND ITS ENEMIES” https://www.amazon.com/FUTURE-ITS-ENEMIES-Creativity-Enterprise/dp/0684862697 

  • When we talk about the word conservative, we mean different things within the United States. Some conservatives today want to conserve the 1950s. True to themselves, others want to conserve the Declaration of Independence and it’s codification in the Constitution

  • “Economic growth is not a cure-all, but lack of growth is a kill-all.” —Paul Collier

Segment two:

  • In the “Markets” section of the Techno-Optimist Manifesto, Andreesen directly addresses transaction costs and the ability of the market to reduce them. This is AirBNB. This is Uber. This is anything that reduces transaction costs.

  • Hayek’s classic paper, "The Use of Knowledge in Society" was referenced by Ron and Ed today. Link is here: https://www.econlib.org/library/Essays/hykKnw.html 

  • “The law lags culture. The law emerges from the culture. It’s a lot easier to trade with one another than it is to just take it from one another.” —Ed Kless on today’s show

  • In summary, we have 300 years of history to prove that technology drives wages up NOT down. More in the “Markets” section of the Techno-Optimist Manifesto https://a16z.com/the-techno-optimist-manifesto/ 

Segment three:

  • Ed dropping geographic knowledge today, “Jamaica and Singapore have roughly the same population and are roughly the same longitudinally.”

  • “Maybe calling [technology] a tool is too utilitarian? At the end of the day, it’s a hammer, it’s a wrench.” —Ron Baker

  • One of the best lines from the Techno-Optimist Manifesto: “We believe Artificial Intelligence is our alchemy, our Philosopher’s Stone – we are literally making sand think.”https://a16z.com/the-techno-optimist-manifesto 

  • The most PROVOCATIVE line in the entire Techno-Optimist Manifesto: “Deaths that were preventable by the AI that was prevented from existing is a form of murder.” https://a16z.com/the-techno-optimist-manifesto/ 

  • Did you know that President Nixon called for the construction of 1,000 nuclear power plants by the year 2000?

Segment four:

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #461: Interview with Hitendra Patil - Rise of The Aiccountants

Ron and Ed welcomed Hitendra Patil, President of the Global Finance and Accounting Outsourcing Services of Datamatics Business Solutions, Inc. and author of Rise of The Aiccountants: The What, Why, and How of Artificial Intelligence for Accountants. AI is way more than an amusement gimmick. At its core, AI is a powerful tool that can make accounting firm operations, analytics, decision-making, and client services more efficient, impactful, and insightful resulting in clients getting more delighted and, importantly, firm staff more productive, engaged, and happier. Unfortunately, other than starting to use publicly available AI tools, firm leaders who want to professionally leverage artificial intelligence often don’t know where to start. AI journey can feel overwhelming—as it requires firms to analyze existing processes, make new choices for software solutions, decide the priorities for applying AI automation and prepare every part of the firm for the transition.

About Hitendra Patil

Hitendra Patil is the author of two critically acclaimed books bought by accountants from 14 countries across five continents. Hitendra is one of the Top 100 Most Influential People in Accounting in the United States, as recognized by Accounting Today, which is the #1 professional trade journal in the US accounting and finance profession. He has also been among the Top 10 Accounting Influencers to Follow on Social Media and the Top 100 Accounting Social Media Leaderboard. He is a regularly published author in many of the leading publications in the accounting profession in the United States. Hitendra provides research-backed, contemporary insights into the accounting profession about practice growth, entrepreneurship in accounting, client accounting services, and emerging technologies, such as artificial intelligence, machine learning, blockchain, and cybersecurity. Hitendra has a keen interest in human behavior science, neuroscience, psychology - and writing. All this culminates in books, articles, blog posts, podcasts, webinars, and content that resonates deeply with the audience to inspire and influence people to take actions that benefit them.

Use these show notes to follow along with audio…

Segment one:

  • “I’m not an AI deep fake. This is the real Hitendra.” That’s how Hitendra started the show today which is EXACTLY what a deep fake Hitendra would say.

  • What is the biggest challenge facing the accounting profession? Separating the symptoms from the core of accounting. In a good way, we are going towards the core purpose of accounting. To help people improve their business and perform better.

  • “If you look at accounting as a profession it has fewer number of celebrities compared to outside the profession. Excluding Ron Baker, of course. […] We need those celebrities to pull people into the profession.” —Hitendra Patil

  • Client Accounting Services. Heard the phrase? Hitendra wrote the book, Client Accounting Services: The Definitive Success Guide https://cpatrendlines.com/shop/hp21cas/ 

Segment two:

  • Hitendra holds the role of President of the Global Finance and Accounting Outsourcing Services of Datamatics Business Solutions and can be found at https://datamaticscpa.com/accounting-bookkeeping-outsourcing-for-usa-cpas/ 

  • In January of 2023, Hitendra published a new book “Rise of The AiCCOUNTANTS”. More info at this link: https://www.amazon.com/Rise-AiCCOUNTANTSTM-Accountants-Artificial-Intelligence/dp/B0BTKSP6M8 

  • Can we get to the point of significantly reducing the audit with artificial intelligence? Audit is facing an extreme talent crunch so it certainly is a candidate. You also handle massive amounts of data in Audit and AI is great for that.

  • What about “wisdom about the situation” when it comes to applying AI to solve problems? AI does not have that context and probably never will. “There is a world that exists outside of the data.” —Hitendra

Segment three:

  • Hitendra refers to “the engagement ring” as pulling in data and analyzing the past, present, and future. It’s a clever way to think about how to help your clients. 

  • If you have 800 CAS customers, how can you work on the future? There’s just not enough time. Doesn’t CAS require fewer customers? “For those who really do CAS, […] the number will surely come down.” —Hitendra Patil

  • If you were to launch a firm today, what would you do? “Make sure I can survive for 1,000 days with saved money. Otherwise, anything that walks in the door is a client.” —Hitendra Patil

  • Do you see CAS firms adopting the subscription model? “OH YES.” —Hitendra Patil

Segment four:

  • Can you be both CAS and CAAS at the same time? “I don’t think CAAS can exist with CAS.” —Hitendra Patil

  • What’s your production function around doing research. “I start with some LinkedIn polls. […] Then I go through proper channels with massive amounts of subscribers. Then I ask what will be useful and actionable for the market from the research.”

  • A big THANK YOU to Hitendra Patil for joining us today to talk about AI and accountants. Check out his book, Rise of The AiCCOUNTANTS, at this link: https://www.amazon.com/Rise-AiCCOUNTANTSTM-Accountants-Artificial-Intelligence/dp/B0BTKSP6M8 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #460: One Thing! - Part Three

Ron and Ed once again share entries from their "One Thing" journals, so this episode is a bit random, but contains nugget after nugget on curated wisdom for the reading and listening habits of the hosts.

Use these show notes to follow along with audio…

Segment One:

  • Ron: Writing a book is more risky than having a child. You can always disown a child.

  • Ed: “The juice is not worth the squeeze.” Not sure I like this metaphor.

  • Ron: What’s your unpopular but good idea or cause? (Asked when Peter Thiel interviews for nonprofits)

  • Ron: Also from Peter Thiel: “Tell me something you believe that most people don’t”

  • Ed: “The time for debate is over!” is almost always code for, “Shut up and do what I say.”

  • Ron: Jonah Goldberg — “Libertarians are like the Huns. You want them on your side, just not in charge.”

  • Ed: “I can’t help but feel like you’re trying to intimidate me into pretending to agree with you." One of the thoughts that economist Bryan Caplan keeps to himself. 

  • Ron: It doesn’t take a dead man to build a coffin (mechanic doesn’t need to drive BMW)

Segment Two:

  • Ed: In 100 years, what will I be wrong about?

  • Ron: Liberty is the absence of oppression. Freedom is the act of commitment: a choice. Peter Block

  • Ed: ‘We are free to choose, we are not free to choose not to choose.’ - Peter Kostenbaum

  • Ron: The problem with the gene pool is there’s no lifeguard, Steven Wright

  • Ed: One of my favorite political fables concerns Dwight D. Eisenhower and his tenure as president of Columbia University. The campus was undergoing an expansion, and Ike was presented with two very different plans for laying out new sidewalks. The architects were irreconcilable, each insisting that his plan was the only way to go and that the other guy had it all wrong. Ike, sensible fellow that he was, had grass planted instead, telling the architects to wait a year and see where the students trod paths in the turf, and then to put the sidewalks there.  - Kevin Williamson

  • Ron: If we evolved from apes, why do apes still exist?

  • Ed: “If the slave eats the food provided by the master, does that mean the slave consents to slavery?” - Mike Munger response to the "Muh roads" argument.

Segment Three:

  • Ron: An American is an Englishman left Alone. Alexis De Toqueville

  • Ed: Principle of “non worst-ness.” Not hiring someone to clean your house because you think it is demeaning to them only make the have to take on another customer who will likely be demeaning.

  • Ron: Argue with conviction, listen as if you were wrong

  • Ed: What have I said “Yes” to that I no longer am truly committed?

  • Ron: I would rather have questions that can’t be answered than answers that can’t be questioned. Richard Feynman

  • Ron: JFK was asked what he was most worried him? 30-40 nations with nuclear weapons. We have 9 with America’s leadership

  • Ed: A man tries to park his car in the Congressional lot. Security comes over and explains that he should not park there because Congress is in session. The guy replies, “It’s okay, I locked the doors.”

  • Ron: Eric Idle: wanted biography title, “Say no more,” but that’s for his Tombstone

Segment Four:

  • Ed: It is an established fact of social science that any bad idea can work for a time in Sweden.

  • Ron: GK Chesterton: Gratitude is happiness doubled by wonder.

  • Ed: The system will reveal true purpose in spite of the stated vision and mission statements or in the absence thereof.

  • Ron: St. Thomas Aquinas: Envy is the only one of the seven deadly sins that isn’t even fun

  • Ron: All models are wrong, some are useful

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #459: The Subscription Attorney: Interview with Mathew Kerbis

This week Ron and Ed welcomed Mathew Kerbis, aka The Subscription Attorney to talk about, you guessed it, subscription-based lawyering. His firm, Subscription Attorney LLC was founded in 2022 and is a modern law firm offering legal advice starting at $19.99/month, to help provide affordable access to legal advice for small business owners, freelancers, and everyday people. As usual the conversation with be mind-bending.

About Mathew Kerbis

Matt founded Subscription Attorney LLC, a modern law firm offering legal advice starting at $19.99/month, to help provide affordable access to legal advice for small business owners, freelancers, and everyday people. His legal services include general legal advice, contracts, real estate, simple estate plans, demand letters, and negotiating disputes to avoid court. Learn more at https://subscriptionattorney.com. He launched the podcast Law Subscribed to help the rest of the legal profession make the same choice.

Use these show notes to follow along with audio…

Segment one:

  • Why did Mathew choose the profession of law? In college he was told, “You study logic, you do well on the LSAT and you can go to law school,” Sounded good enough to him :) 

  • Fast forward to today and now Mathew is the founder of Subscription Attorney, LLC at https://subscriptionattorney.com/

  • Mathew has the same disdain for the billable hour as we do. Ron was sure to call this out during the first segment and Mathew was quick to give background on what brought him to this conclusion.

Segment two:

  • Mathew pivoted to the founder of Subscription Attorney, LLC while building a book of transactional business in the background. His story should sound familiar to many. It took grit and lots of networking.

  • The pricing model for Subscription Attorney, LLC starts at $19.99 per month which includes access to Mathew, his flat fee services, and his growing knowledge base.

  • Cost CERTAINTY is something that makes Mathew’s clients very happy. The price is clear and there is no hourly rate. More here: https://subscriptionattorney.com 

  • How does Mathew decide what he covers and what he doesn’t cover? His engagement agreement is publicly available on his website at this link: https://subscriptionattorney.com/#engagement 

  • Mathew has a great Zoom background that includes a QR code. Check it out here (and think about doing it yourself?

Segment three:

  • As your attorney, I highly recommend you listen to Mathew’s podcast where he talks about people who are innovating in the law space. More info here: https://linktr.ee/lawsubscribed @lawsubscribed

  • What is the number one thing Mathew sees with his clients as a result of moving away from the billable hour and towards subscription? “THEY ARE NOT AFRAID TO CALL ME” — nailed it!

  • “How much money you make is not based on your time anymore.” —Mathew Kerbis when talking about moving away from the billable hour.

  • Making the cancel button PROMINENT and EASY to find means the customer/member is even more comfortable with your service.

Segment four:

  • General practitioners might get to the point one day where they can subscribe to specialists on behalf of their customers/members. Mathew calls this “subscription arbitrage” and it’s a brilliant term.

  • “This can’t be done” is something Mathew is not hearing much anymore. Instead, he is hearing “This is genius. Why didn’t I think of that?” more and more often…

  • Shift Supervisor at Starbucks is something you will see on Mathew’s LinkedIn profile. The story behind his experience there and how he was pulled it forward is great (check out segment four of the show today)

  • A big THANK YOU to Mathew Kerbis for joining us today. Check out the Subscription Attorney at this link https://subscriptionattorney.com/ 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #458: Disneyland on the Mountain — Kathryn Mayer and Greg Glasgow

Ed and Ron could not wait to interview Kathryn Mayer and Greg Glasgow and discuss their brand new book, Disneyland on the Mountain, released September 13, 2023. If you are a Disney fan, you do not want to miss this episode!

About Kathryn Mayer

Kathryn Mayer is a Denver-based writer and journalist whose work has appeared in numerous publications including Health, Observer, Insider, and PopSugar. She primarily writes about business, covering workplace health and benefits strategies, and she has appeared on radio, TV, and podcasts as an industry expert. This is her first book.

About Greg Glasgow

Greg Glasgow is a longtime writer and journalist for numerous magazines and newspapers in Colorado and elsewhere, including The Denver Post, 5280, and the Boulder Daily Camera, where he worked for ten years as arts and entertainment reporter and editor. He lives in Colorado with his wife and coauthor, Kathryn Mayer, and their dog, Audrey. This is his first book.

Use these show notes to follow along with audio…

Segment one:

  • “Disneyland On The Mountain” is about a ski resort that Disney attempted to build in California starting in 1965. For about 13+ years, the project dragged on until it hit the Supreme Court.

  • Willy Schaeffler was Walt’s partner on the “Disneyland On The Mountain” project. He escaped Nazi Germany to the US and created several famous ski slopes and rides, especially in Colorado.

  • “Disneyland On The Mountain” was intended to be built in Mineral King, CA near Sequoia National Park. There’s plenty of backstory in the book at this link https://www.amazon.com/Disneyland-Mountain-Environmentalists-Resort-Never/dp/1538173670 

  • Walter spelled backwards (Ret Law) was the super secret project codename for “Disneyland On The Mountain” which was meant to be built in Mineral King, CA. More here: https://www.amazon.com/Disneyland-Mountain-Environmentalists-Resort-Never/dp/1538173670 

Segment two:

  • What do the University of Denver, Walt Disney, and Willy Schaeffler have in common? It’s this combination that brought Kathryn and Greg together to write “Disneyland On The Mountain” https://www.amazon.com/Disneyland-Mountain-Environmentalists-Resort-Never/dp/1538173670 

  • Silver was the first mineral to be discovered in Mineral King, California. In 1965, it became the chosen location for Walt Disney to build a ski resort. 

  • Harrison “Buzz” Price is the economist that picked the locations for Disneyland and Disney World. More info on Wikipedia about Buzz is at this link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrison_Price 

  • Fun fact: Robert Brandt (husband to Janet Leigh, star of the movie Psycho) was the first person to approach the Federal government and ask for the land in Mineral King, CA to be put up for bid.

Segment three:

  • Planned in the 1960s, the Walt Disney ski resort was going to include skiing, sledding, tobogganing, and ice skating in the winter months plus camping, biking, hiking, nature classes in the summer.

  • Ed referenced a YouTube channel and how they have a video about the topic of the book, “Disneyland On The Mountain”. More here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWEk34VwcvU 

  • So what ultimately happened to the land that Disney purchased for the now defunct ski resort? Disney still owns some land in the Mineral King, CA area.

  • Talking about ski resorts, Ed referenced this Wall Street Journal article today about how an Idaho town could become the next Jackson Hole https://www.wsj.com/real-estate/luxury-homes/driggs-idaho-real-estate-market-57f888c9 

Segment four:

  • Eventually, the planned Disney ski resort became mired in law suits. While Disney was not directly sued, the Federal government had to represent themselves in the case regarding the planned development.

  • Fun TSOE fact: Did you know that Ron has a commemorative brick at Disneyland?

  • A big THANK YOU to Kathryn and Greg for joining us today. Folks, if you have ever heard of Disney (that's all of you) then you NEED to read “Disneyland On The Mountain”. Link is here: https://www.amazon.com/Disneyland-Mountain-Environmentalists-Resort-Never/dp/1538173670 

 
 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #457: Simple Complexity — Interview with William Donaldson

This week Ron and Ed welcomed William Donaldson, author of Simple_Complexity to the show. Every business leader knows a business is a system, yet very few have studied systems thinking or system dynamics. This is a critical oversight, one that Simple_Complexity remedies. Simple_Complexity reveals the fundamental system archetype at work in your enterprise and prescribes new and exciting ways to reinvigorate your management thinking.

About Dr. William Donaldson
Dr. William (Willy) Donaldson has over 35 years of experience and has been CEO of 8 companies, and helped start dozens of companies. Willy is the Founder and President of Strategic Venture Planning, a management consulting firm that assists boards, investors, families, and senior management teams to maximize results.

Use these show notes to follow along with audio…

Segment one:

  • Thank you to Mark Gandy for introducing us to Willy Donaldson. He interviewed Willy on April 30th https://cfobookshelf.com/the-systems-thinking-mindset/ 

  • Much of the credit for getting into systems thinking goes to Willy’s father. They both have an engineering background in aeronautical and industrial engineering, father and son respectively

  • The two top enemies of systems thinking are politics and academics, which might explain why you didn’t learn about this topic in school

  • The book, Simple_Complexity, has the background you need on systems thinking. Here is the Amazon link: https://www.amazon.com/Simple_Complexity-Management-Guide-Systems-Thinking/dp/1683500741  

  • Regarding systems thinking: “There are no boundaries between any of the departments or actions. They are all integrated.” —William Donaldson

Segment two:

  • So WHY the underscore between Simple and Complexity in Willy’s book, Simple_Complexity? “You have to tie the two together.” —William Donaldson https://www.amazon.com/Simple_Complexity-Management-Guide-Systems-Thinking/dp/1683500741  

  • Our guest today, William Donaldson, author of Simple_Complexity, loves this quote from George Box: “All models are wrong. Some are useful.”

  • Willy visited the Enron website the day they filed for bankruptcy and pulled down their statement of values. They included transparency, honesty, and integrity. Of course they did!

  • Unless you have the context [in a system] you’ll get completely lost. Imagine how often a manager does this and does not provide context for something. On #AskTSOE, we call this the effing debate  

Segment three:

  • “We have to make our systems predictable and repeatable so that we can scale.” It’s a worthy goal but a fools errand. The model you are setting the system up for is constantly changing. You have to change as well.

  • If you want to hear why Willy sometimes calls governance boards the “Chowder and Marching Society” then listen to segment three of the show. https://www.thesoulofenterprise.com/457 

  • Culture emerges from the system. There is no culture in an organization initially. It’s just an assemblage of people. Your culture emerges and people pick it up. It comes from the interaction of the elements in an organization.

  • Why are organizations calling people back to the office? One part of it is that if you’re not in person, you are missing out on serendipity and richness of interaction. 

Segment four:

  • “Strategy is the art of being able to stay one step ahead of needing to be efficient.” —Dr. Jules Goddard

  • “The future is already here – it's just not evenly distributed.” —William Gibson

  • “Change brings about great uncertainty unless we are very clear and very precise with our language.” —William Donaldson; In other words, “Common language, common mental model”

  • A big THANK YOU to Willy Donaldson for joining us today. His book is “Simple_Complexity: A Management Book For The Rest of Us: A Guide to Systems Thinking”. https://www.amazon.com/Simple_Complexity-Management-Guide-Systems-Thinking/dp/1683500741 

 
 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #456: Booxkeeping — Interview with Max Emma

Ron and Ed welcomed accounting thought leader Max Emma, CEO and Chief Bookkeeping Officer of Booxkeeping Franchise. BooXkeeping is a nationwide provider of affordable outsourced bookkeeping services to small and medium-sized businesses. We will talk to Max about his business model and why outsource bookkeeping will continue to grow. Booxkeeping Franchise is a low-cost and easy-to-operate bookkeeping business solution for aspiring entrepreneurs. As the CEO of BooXkeeping Franchise, Inc., They find potential franchisees and offer them a turn-key opportunity to join the BooXkeeping family and benefit from our innovative accounting services, proven systems, and ongoing support. Their goal is to offer franchising opportunities in all 50 states by 2025 and to bring new life to one of the world's oldest professions.

About Max Emma
With multiple years of experience as the CEO and Chief Bookkeeping Officer at BooXkeeping Corp., Max Emma leads a team of professional accountants who provide high-quality and reliable bookkeeping services to a variety of businesses nationwide. He created a unique structure for BooXkeeping Corp., where each client gets two to three accountants working on their behalf, ensuring the highest accuracy and efficiency for their finances. Max also oversee the preparation of the income statements and balance sheets that are critical for our clients' success and growth.

Use these show notes to follow along with audio…

Segment one:

  • Today’s show is really special in that we are welcoming Max Emma, co-founder of Booxkeeping. He is our newest sponsor and guest on today’s show. His origin story begins in the former Soviet Union. Hear more during the first segment.

  • Max started working with Qualcomm and has been through the construction industry, the landscaping industry, and ultimately the bookkeeping industry

  • A few years ago Booxkeeping became a franchisor after Max had a “crazy” idea that he could do it. With his entrepreneurial background, of course he could!

  • Max’s team offers customers a fixed price, the same team on each account, and at least two people doing the work that minimizes the possibility of errors. Franchisors have responded really positively to this.

  • Billing at a fixed price was an EARLY innovation for Booxkeeping and Max talked about exactly what you would expect in terms of benefits. The model pulled cash forward and reduced receivables.

Segment two:

  • Max has noticed over the years that it takes less time to handle bookkeeping tasks due to advancing technology. His company has embraced this in their pricing philosophy and pass along rate savings to the customers.

  • Max started the Booxkeeping business - before franchising - by white label bookkeeping for CPA firms. That is still a large part of the original firm’s revenue model.

  • Ron asked about the penetration pricing strategy employed by Booxkeeping Franchise today. “Absolutely” was Max’s response and he went on to explain how the pricing is tiered.

  • From a tech stack perspective, Booxkeeping supports Sage, Quickbooks, Xero, and even Netsuite. They do not discriminate but do have a singular system that was developed exclusively for their internal operations.

Segment three:

  • The general idea behind Booxkeeping is that a CPA firm can buy the service and outsource the bookkeeping work themselves.

  • March of 2020 is when franchising was started for Booxkeeping but it took 14-15 months to really get started due to Covid.

  • The very first customer of Booxkeeping Franchise was the very first employee at Booxkeeping! Talk about “what comes around goes around” :) 

  • The Booxkeeping franchise fee is $29,995, $19,995 if you have an existing bookkeeping firm and also a 30% discount for active military, veterans, and first responders. Check out more info here: https://www.booxkeepingfranchise.com/ 

Segment four:

  • What is the future for the bookkeeping industry? From Max: More and more outsourcing will continue to be the trend. Businesses will continue to need day to day numbers.

  • The first Booxkeeping Franchise customer 7x her revenue after getting started. She didn’t learn accounting. Instead, she learned how to sell, how to network, what to say, and what not to say

  • Max Emma provided a book to Ron called, “10x Is Easier Than 2x”. Ron found it extremely profound. More here: https://www.amazon.com/10x-Easier-Than-World-Class-Entrepreneurs/dp/140196995X 

  • A big THANK YOU to Max Emma of Booxkeeping Franchise for being both a TSOE sponsor AND a great guest! Check out more information about his company here: https://www.booxkeepingfranchise.com/ 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #455: A Cautionary Tale about AI & Obviousity

This week Ron and Ed return to the work of literature for some inspiration. They delve into the pages of the Roald Dahl short story, "The Great Automatic Grammatizator" and Robert R. Updegraff's, “Obvious Adams: The Story of a Successful Businessman”. Both are available on the website that rhymes with Shamazon if you want to read them prior to listening.

Use these show notes to follow along with audio…

Segment One:

  • The Great Automatic Grammatizator is a story written by Roald Dahl in 1954 about an ingenious engineer who creates a machine called the Great Automatic Grammatizator that can write stories and novels in just minutes

  • 1/4 Story summary: 📝 Lex is a struggling writer 🤔🖋️ who meets the eccentric inventor Max 🤪🔬. Max creates a machine 🤖💻 that writes perfect stories in seconds! 😱📚

  • 2/4 📈 Lex sees the potential for profit 💰💡 and convinces Max to mass-produce the machine. They become wealthy 🤑💸, but creativity suffers 📉🤷‍♂️.

  • 3/4 🖋️📜 Traditional writers lose jobs 🙅‍♂️📝, and stories lack heart ❤️🧡. Lex realizes the damage done and destroys the machine 🚫🤖.

  • 4/4 Sound familiar? By the way, the tweets in this series were all written by ChatGPT.

Segment Two:

  • Here is a significant sentence about an author’s perspective from Roald Dahl’s short story, The Great Automatic Grammitizator: “Because she saw the machines made stuff that was better than her own”

  • Rory Sutherland has been encouraging people to read the superb business book, “Obvious Adams” for many years now. We found this tweet from 2016. https://twitter.com/rorysutherland/status/693412082876825601 

  • Obvious Adams is about Adam, a simple, insightful man who sees solutions where others don't. He uses common sense to solve business problems (which can be a bit of a lost art). https://www.amazon.com/dp/0990790916?tag=verainst-20 

  • Did you know that our Patreon.com/TSOE is sponsored by @90Minds? Need a mind? Find one at 90minds.com

Segment Three:

  • The "Five Tests of Obviousness" are a concept outlined in the book Ed and Ron are discussing today: "Obvious Adams" by Robert R. Updegraff https://www.amazon.com/dp/0990790916?tag=verainst-20 

  • The “Five Tests of Obviousness” encourage you to approach problem-solving with simplicity and common sense. Remember, sometimes the most effective solutions are the ones that are right in front of us.

  • Have you heard this in a business context? “We tried it before and it didn’t work.” Based on the “Five Test of Obviousness”, maybe the timing wasn’t right???

  • “Sometimes the first duty of intelligent men is the restatement of the obvious” —George Orwell.

Segment Four:

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #454: Interview with ChatGPeterD — an AI conversation with Peter Drucker

This week Ron and Ed literally explore the boundaries of AI by conducting an "interview" with an AI incarnation of Peter Drucker. Using ChatGPT and Speech Synthesis from ElevenLabs, Ron and Ed ask the questions and ChatGPeterD provides the answers. Topic range from knowledge workers, to annual appraisals, to AARs, to consulting in a hot tub.

What would be more fitting than AI generated show notes?

  • Peter’s legacy in the business world.
    Peter reflects on the impact his ideas have had on the business world and the global reach of his principles.
    Peter shares some of his thoughts on the future of leadership.
    The notion of social responsibility of business and the concept of management as a liberal arts education.
    The idea of planned abandonment and how it can help organizations maintain a competitive edge.

  • The social responsibility of business and profits.
    Milton friedman's argument that the social responsibility of businesses to increase profits is not the primary purpose of a business.
    The debate between shareholder value and social responsibility is not an either or proposition.
    The challenge lies in aligning these dual objectives in a way that leads to sustainable and responsible business practices.
    Profitability and social responsibility can coexist and reinforce each other.
    Vivek Ramaswamy and others have raised concerns about the manipulation of societal concerns and the phenomenon of greenwashing.
    Businesses should approach social responsibility with a genuine and sincere commitment to social responsibility.

  • How are the knowledge economy and knowledge workers different from the previous models?
    How the knowledge economy and knowledge workers are different than those that preceded them, and how they are different from the earlier economies.
    A word from the sponsors, soul of enterprise.
    Knowledge workers rely on their expertise, problem solving skills and ability to think critically and adapt to changing circumstances.
    Innovation and creative problem solving become essential for staying competitive.
    A holistic approach to management is required, encompassing factors such as meaningful work autonomy, professional development, work-life balance and recognition.
    Why he chose to call himself a social ecologist rather than a management thinker.

  • Does one learn more from success vs. failure?
    Success and failure offer distinct and valuable learning experiences, and the true wisdom lies in embracing and extracting insights from both outcomes, success and failure.
    Peter explains why he believes that success is often more readily transferable to different situations due to the identification of principles applied in diverse scenarios.
    Efficiency refers to the ability to accomplish a task or produce an output with the least amount of resources, time or effort. effectiveness is about doing the right things.
    A word from

  • Why are you critical of annual performance appraisals?
    Critical of knowledge workers performing tasks that distract from their real work, such as nurses filling out paperwork or accountants and lawyers filling out timesheets.
    Critical of annual performance appraisals.
    Performance appraisals were initially introduced with the intention of evaluating and improving employee performance, but there are several limitations associated with the traditional annual appraisal process.
    The importance of frequent and informal feedback mechanisms.
    The evolution of performance appraisal systems has been a topic of ongoing debate and refinement in the management field.
    The theory of the business, the mental model that guides an organization's actions, choices and priorities.

  • Innovation and Entrepreneurship.
    Innovation and entrepreneurship are closely related concepts, but they have distinct meanings and implications within the realm of business and management.
    You suggest that leaders should spend the majority of their time pursuing opportunities rather than solely focusing on solving problems, based on his belief in proactive and strategic management.
    Peter wrote a book in 1993 called the post-capitalist society, which aims to provide insights into the evolving nature of society and the potential shifts in society.

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #453: Interview with Seth David from Nerd Enterprises

Ron and Ed welcome Seth David from Nerd Enterprises, Inc to talk about his work with accounting professionals and customers. Seth's superpower is communicating complex financial concepts in easy-to-understand terms. Going beyond accounting, he delves into the intersection of business and technology, recently authoring a piece on why the internet browser experience is long overdue for an overhaul.

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio…

Segment one:

  • Seth has a reputation for being at the forefront of technology. He wrote a blog post a few months ago about the lack of innovation in the internet browser experience. Check it out here: https://www.nerdenterprises.com/blog/the-internet-browser-experience-is-long-overdue-for-an-overhaul 

  • More recently, Seth wrote an article called “Living on the Edge” about his switch to Microsoft Edge. He doesn’t advocate for all Microsoft products but enjoys using the Edge browser. https://www.nerdenterprises.com/blog/living-on-the-edge 

  • TIL that Microsoft Edge saves your tabs even when you close the application. I have personally closed Chrome by accident and cursed under my breath because it doesn’t remember all of your tabs 🤣 🤣 🤣

  • What are people missing about AI beyond ChatGPT? Seth has a great opinion on this as an example. Think about eCommerce data and imagine if you, as an accountant, could provide competitive pricing information to your customers. 

  • With respect to Artificial Intelligence, Seth says, “People who avoid it will be forced to use it or just get left behind.” 

Segment two:

  • Anyone who knew Seth in high school would never have guessed that he would have gone into accounting. He was much more of a creative than anything else. You can clearly see the intersection today in his work.

  • Seth’s backstory takes several unexpected turns during segment two of the show today. Folks….I can’t do this stuff justice in a tweet. You should listen to Seth describe his path to California from New York via Wall Street and a drug addiction.

  • Seth seems to give away his intellectual capital much like Ron and Ed. It forces you to replenish it and keeps you on the bleeding edge. The Nerd Enterprises blog is just one example https://www.nerdenterprises.com/blog/ 

Segment three:

  • Seth recently bifurcated his business. He sold his bookkeeping clients to a long time associate and focuses on training now. “Better Tools. Better Training. Bulletproof Results!” https://www.nerdenterprises.com/ 

  • “If you make me Google something to understand what you are saying, you have failed at Communications 101.” —Seth David

  • When Seth thinks about accounting services and how compliance based it is, it seems difficult to scale because you will most commonly trade your time for money.

Segment four:

  • Agility trumps ability. I don’t have to be the most skilled person on the planet. “The agility refers to your ability to have a bunch of tools in your toolbox.” —Seth David 

  • “When you drop a rock into a lake, the lake receives that rock. It takes it all in.” —Seth David …That’s what Seth does when learning about new tools to help him and his customers do a better job.

  • A big THANK YOU to Seth David for joining us today. Folks, he likes it when you talk nerdy to him. Check out more of his work at https://www.nerdenterprises.com 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #452: Business Models of the Future Knowledge Worker with Hector Garcia

Ron and Ed usually wait six months before having a previous Guest reappear on the show. This is one of the exceptions. Our conversation for this show focused on a new conference that Hector and his team are developing, Business Models of the Future Knowledge Worker. Hector shared his thoughts and we had a live brainstorming event around topic for conversation at the conference.

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio…

Segment one:

  • Will accountants be displaced by AI? Well, yes. Those that do not use AI tools to help themselves will be replaced. Hector has been doing a large amount of experimentation here and talked about it today.

  • Will AI continue to advance at a rapid rate? Of course it will. Look at something as simple as nails. They’ve been around for about 100 years and CONTINUE to show even tiny advances. And that’s just a simple metal nail.

  • ChatGPT has opened Hector’s mind to the creative possibilities and the things he can do as an accountant and leader of the profession. He experiments with these tools because he wants to stay at the forefront and be a part of the movement.

  • It’s time for “self disruption”. Creation…preservation…and destruction . Hector studied Hinduism in college and draws a strong parallel to his desire for “self disruption” in the accounting profession.

Segment two:

  • Hector was very kind to give Ron Baker a shout out today for his work around Time’s Up. Check out more information at this link if you are curious or interested https://timesupclub.com/ 

  • Hector is REALLY excited about a conference on October 25-27th in Miami called Creative Business Models for Accountants. Here is the link for the FINAL 22 tickets! https://altaccountant.com/creative/ 

  • Subscription is the easiest, most friction free way to collect revenue from customers but THEN it allows us as accountants to focus on important things like the delivery platform and overall customer experience

  • Hey! Did you know that our Patreon channel at Patreon.com/TSOE is sponsored by @90Minds? Need a mind? Find one at 90Minds.com

Segment three:

  • Alan asked a great question today about changing the business model of his industry. Ron, Hector, and Ed all had some great thoughts that are DIFFICULT to capture in 140 (280? 5,000?) characters. Check it out in segment three.

  • In wealth management, customers have been taught that paying a finance professional is only a function of how much money is being moved around. But the real advice has almost nothing to do with just moving money around.

  • The customer of the future will buy from firms that provide two things: 1) to feel good/secure about who they are interacting with and 2) to work with the company providing the least amount of friction when working towards a goal

  • “The best products in the world offer some sort of lifetime guarantee and that’s what people buy.” —Hector Garcia

  • Hector recently made the shift to subscription and had this short, INSIGHTFUL statement to share: “You transform your firm one customer at a time.”

Segment four:

  • For rising seniors in high school, Ed is not convinced that the job they will do even exists yet. In fact, he’s not even sure their final major in college exists….just FOUR YEARS from now. How’s that for a rate of change?

  • “If we are professionals understand that communication is about translation — reframing a problem — you can move much faster.” —Hector Garcia

  • A big THANK YOU to Hector Garcia for joining us today. There are only 22 TICKETS left (as of this tweet….er….”X”) for his conference in October in Miami. Check our more info at this link https://altaccountant.com/creative/ 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #451: Mishmash

In keeping with our tradition of Bric-a-brac, Grab-bag, Potpurri, and Miscellany, Ron and Ed present their thoughts on some articles and posts on varied topics that require more than just a cursory conversation, but not quite a full episode.

Ron’s links mentioned during the show:

Use these AI generated show notes to follow along with the audio.

School vouchers.

  • Happy birthday to Milton Friedman!

  • Friedman made the case for school vouchers in the 1955 essay, and that idea found its way into capitalism and freedom.

  • The number of earnings calls where executives mention environmental initiatives is declining.

They don't want to reform school they want to end school.

  • Nobody wants to reform school. Nobody wants to end schooling. What parent wants to do this?

  • Moving to a voucher system or an educational savings account program, or an esa program in Arizona, gives a lot more flexibility in terms of finances and makes so much sense.

  • State after state after state is rolling out this program across all political sectors.

  • The modern quest for immortality, by lionel shriver, a novelist and columnist for British Spectator magazine.

  • With eternity at stake, with that at stake who would be voluntary for the military?

  • The burden of finding purpose and meaning could grow unbearable, she says.

What is the quality of the extra time?

  • Concerns about the quality of that extra time, and how it would impact the social security system from an economic standpoint.

  • The knowledge problem of a shrinking worldwide population and the need for more knowledge, learning, growth and innovation.

  • The summer of 1994, the book, well it's called the question, by Eugene Jenna Basie, a historian.

  • We broke all records for mass slaughter piling up 10s of millions of corpses in less than three quarters of a century when the asian figures are properly calculated.

  • The importance of subjecting basic premises to stern review and own up to all that has gone wrong and take the measures necessary to guarantee against the next round of the same old story.

  • The turning point that shifted Jonah's mind from supporting the collapse of the Soviet Union to questioning it.

How hard is it to change a culture of denial?

  • The soviet union has not accounted for its past. The soviet union has done nothing to rectify the wrongs of the Soviet Union.

  • It is hard to change a culture, which is why theories work so well, because it is just the language and the persuasion.

  • China under the communist party is a nation in long-term decline, weaker than it wants the world to believe.

  • More than half of china's middle school age students are unable to advance to high school or choose not to complete junior high, some 400 million future working age chinese may be classified as cognitively handicapped.

  • Unemployment rate in china is 20% higher than the general population, and they are dependent on Russia for natural resources.

  • China is no longer the low cost producer.

Corruption in the car industry.

  • The two party system in China is better than a one party system, for sure, but they still have a lot of issues that nobody talks about.

  • The economist's special report on the car industry is one of their special reports from April 22, 22, this year.

  • Global car production peaked at 73 million passenger vehicles in 2017, but is expected to drop to 62 million by 2022, according to mckinsey.

  • Legacy carmakers are facing a big challenge.

  • By the end of this decade, the sticker price of most evs will be equal to that of an internal combustion engine.

  • By 2020, charging could go from 66 billion in 2023 to 300 billion by 2020. Most of it will go to tesla because they get the half.

Subscription model for cars.

  • The electric engine is a very basic concept. The basic concept is unchanged completely, and it is just as simple to produce. It feels like driving a slot racer.

  • The emerging subscription model for cars is easier for a tech firm to make cars than it is for a carmaker.

  • Only about 8% of petrol heads are real car buyers, and only 1% of new cars are bought by people under the age of 24, according to mckinsey.

  • Sony and Honda are teaming up with software companies to make evs and alibaba, huawei, tencent and zami.

  • I have a business breakthrough. Paul shrimpbling, humanize the numbers. Book. The fearless organization creating psychological safety in the workplace for learning, innovation and growth. By amy edmondson.

  • Project aristotle, a multi-year study of 100 Navy teams at Google that looked at their composition, educational backgrounds, skills, personality traits.

The importance of building trust in an organization.

  • There has been an uptick in conversation about sage on the sage thought leadership podcast and other psychological safety podcasts.

  • After action reviews are a perpetual tool for psychological safety.

  • The importance of the debrief of course in the air force and the importance of rapid decision making under uncertainty.

  • The book is one of his top books of the year.

“Time sheets are not evil though what we do with them sometimes is”

  • 75% of revenue in a professional still generated by the billable hour.

  • Time tracking is the tool, but it is the ideology around the timesheet that is the problem, not the idea of who is implementing it. No good way to implement a crappy idea.

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #450: Interview with Bryan Caplan

Ron and Ed welcome Bryan Caplan, professor of economics at George Mason University. Bryan is a prolific author and speaker on wide range of economic and other fantastically nerdy topics from voting to role playing games. Bryan's substack, Bet on It, has addressed the following topics in the month of July alone:

Prepare to be impressed.

About Bryan Caplan

Bryan Caplan is a Professor of Economics at George Mason University and New York Times Bestselling author. He has written The Myth of the Rational Voter, named "the best political book of the year" by the New York Times; Selfish Reasons to Have More Kids; The Case Against Education; Open Borders (co-authored with SMBC's Zach Weinersmith); How Evil Are Politicians? He is the editor and chief writer for Bet On It, the blog hosted by the Salem Center for Policy at the University of Texas. He has published in the New York Times, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, TIME, Newsweek, Atlantic, American Economic Review, Economic Journal, Journal of Law and Economics, and Intelligence, and appeared on ABC, BBC, Fox News, MSNBC, and C-SPAN. An openly nerdy man who loves role-playing games and graphic novels, he lives in Oakton, Virginia, with his wife and four kids.

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio.

Segment one:

  • The Case Against Education came out in 2018. It’s thought provoking work from our guest today, Bryan Caplan. Education is NOT a bad idea. It’s a bad idea to subsidize it. https://www.amazon.com/Case-against-Education-System-Waste/dp/0691174652 

  • From Bryan today, based on his work in “The Case Against Education”… -> Education is a passport to real training which happens on the job.

  • The 80/20 rule applies to Bryan’s analysis of education. From him, “When countries invest in education […] they seem to only get about 1/5th of what you would expect when compared to the individual.”

  • Bryan was understandably hesitant on this statement. There’s a LOT to unpack on his comment about public education and a tweet doesn’t do it justice: “Looking at the facts, the truth is most parents don’t want something that different from what exists. Most parents are at least content with the status quo.”

Segment two:

Segment three:

Segment four:

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #449: The Innoficiency Principle featuring Blair Enns

Blair Enns is the founder of Win Without Pitching, the sales training organization for creative professionals. He is the author of two books, The Win Without Pitching Manifesto and Pricing Creativity: A Guide to Profit Beyond the Billable Hour. He is the co-host, along with David C. Baker, of the podcast 2Bobs: Conversations on the Art of Creative Entrepreneurship.

Best of all, he was the guest on this show with Ron and Ed. A good portion of the show was spent talking about The Innoficiency Principle. Blair laid out the thoughts behind this principle at this link and described it quite succinctly. From Blair: “The Innoficiency Principle states that innovation and efficiency are mutually opposable goals. In any reasonably functioning organization, one cannot be increased without decreasing the other.”

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio.

Segment two:

Segment three:

Segment four:

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #448: Systems Thinking Made Simpler

Join Ed and Ron as they discuss the book by William Donaldson, PhD: Simple_Complexity: A Guide to Systems Thinking. Systems are both simple and complex, which contain amazing constructs that one often must marvel. Systems also have a mind and a rhythm of their own. The parts do not exist independent of the whole, and you can't understand the parts without understanding the whole, and the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. Your organization's culture is an emergent property of your system. If you want to change the culture, you have to change the system, which is comprised of three components: Elements; Interactions; and Purpose. Hat tip to Mark Gandy at CFO Bookshelf for interviewing the author of this excellent book.

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio.

Segment one:

Segment two:

Segment three:

Segment four:

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #447: Third interview with Tim Williams

For the third time, Ron and Ed welcomed back Tim Williams, one of the foremost thinkers about professional firm strategy and positioning. Tim thinks deeply about these topics, but has the ability to simplify and communicate complex topics to us and his audiences worldwide. We also asked him about his thinking with regard to generative AI and the potential impact on advertising and marketing.

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio.

Segment one:

  • If you are a professional knowledge firm, then Tim Williams book was written just for you https://www.amazon.com/Positioning-Professionals-Professional-Knowledge-Differentiate/dp/0470587156

  • You heard it here first. Tim Williams thinks that AI is the final nail in the coffin for timesheets. It’s a bold prediction but those that come true feel nothing but bold in hindsight.

  • Written in 2019 (wow!!!), Tim Williams article titled “Billing by the Nanosecond?” is something we suspect most of you will be interested in reading https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/billing-nanosecond-tim-williams 

  • “When it comes to positioning we are looking for patterns and common threads in the experience and expertise of knowledge workers.” —Tim Wiiliams

  • “In the end there is still a lot of subjective judgement that needs to be applied in the work of an ad agency. [AI] is a riffing partner that helps explore possibilities and options.” —Tim Williams

  • Are there AI roles popping up in the advertising agency space? Yes. A few examples from Tim: AI artists spend their days with Stable Diffusion, Dall-E, or Midjourney; AI writers create simple paragraphs to plugin as copy. 

Segment two:

Segment three:

  • What’s happening with subscription in the advertising space? Tim preaches it everywhere he goes and dives into the details during segment three of the show.

  • Does Tim see any subscription fatigue in his industry? No because it’s not nearly established enough.

  • “The most interesting new examples of productization involve some form of AI [such as] prediction machines developed by PR firms.”

  • Ogilvy recently announced the AI Accountability Act. More here: https://www.shots.net/news/view/ogilvy-launches-the-ai-accountability-act 

  • What’s the new magic work? “Experimenting with how AI can easily develop storyboards instead of sitting down and hiring an Illustrator.” —Tim Williams

Segment four:

  • “The way in which the agency business operates has become so reactionary. They talk about filling scopes of work as through they are fast food operators instead of providing thought leadership.” —Tim Williams

  • When it comes to leading brands in any industry, “It is the role of the leader to educate. Generally, what you are doing is educating about the category and not the brand.” —Tim Williams

  • “You must be boxed in otherwise you have no strategy. The four walls of the box are what, who, way, and why.” —Tim Williams

  • A big THANK YOU to Tim Williams for joining us today. If you loved listening today, check out his firm — Ignition Consulting Group — for LOTS of great writing from Tim. https://www.ignitiongroup.com/ 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #446: On Why AI Will Save the World by Marc Andreessen

In this episode Ron and Ed dissected a recent blog post by Marc Andreessen entitled "Why AI Will Save the World." It is a deep and thoughtful piece by someone who has done some very deep thinking. We discussed the items upon which agree and those with which we quibble. The post can be found here.

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio.

Segment one:

Segment two:

Segment three:

Segment four:

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #445: Second interview with Peter Block

Ron and Ed welcomed back the Godfather of modern consulting, Peter Block, for his second appearance. This episode is dedicated to the possibility that human beings are better served when we confront our freedom (the title of Peter's new book). Doing so, is difficult, challenging, and not for everyone. If you want to begin the process of confronting your own freedom, you are invited to participate in this episode. Safe return doubtful!

About Peter Block

Peter Block is an author and citizen of Cincinnati, Ohio. He is a partner in Designed Learning, a training company that offers workshops designed to build the skills outlined in his books. His books include Flawless Consulting, Stewardship, The Answer to How Is Yes, Community, The Abundant Community, and An Other Kingdom. Peter is a founder of the Common Good Collective, is part of the Common Good Alliance of Greater Cincinnati, and was a member of his local neighborhood council. Peter’s work is in the restoration of the common good and creating a world that reclaims our humanity from the onslaught of modernism.

To find out more, see: www.peterblock.com

Designed Learning, Inc. (www.designedlearning.com) offers training and consulting in Flawless Consulting and Community: The Structure of Belonging or Leader as Convener.

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio.

Segment one:

  • Peter Block mentions in his new book, “The cost of freedom is anxiety. This is not a great value proposition.” The traditional professional contract effectively says, “You work for us and we will keep you safe. We will take care of you.” https://www.amazon.com/Confronting-Our-Freedom-Accountability-Belonging/dp/139415609X

  • “The annual performance appraisal is control masquerading with an incentive to make things better.” —Peter Block

  • Why do leaders think accountability is reluctantly chosen? “It shows that evidence is not persuasive.” —Peter Block

  • Question to an employer: “What do you do?” Employer: “I grow people.” Peter Block: “Really? So you’re a gardener and I’m a weed?”

  • “The wish for safety [in an organization] is an illusion. Why not choose an illusion that better serves you.” —Peter Block

  • “When you’re sitting in a dentist chair how long is a minute? Too long. When you’re in love how long is a week? Too short.” —Peter Block

Segment two:

  • “Philosophy offers the possibility of providing new ways to explore old ground.” —Peter Block. This is not the language of the engineer or economist. It places meaning first.

  • Anxiety is the price you pay for your freedom. Peter Block takes this great quote further in his most recent book. More here https://www.amazon.com/Confronting-Our-Freedom-Accountability-Belonging/dp/139415609X 

  • “Businesses — organizations — are human systems. Even if it’s 98% AI. Artificial Intelligence is interesting but it doesn’t mean it solves anything fundamental.” —Peter Block

  • We shouldn’t avoid these topics. In business you should ask, “What doubts do you have about what you are doing? What anxiety do you have?” —Peter Block

  • “Depression is looking backwards. Anxiety is looking forward.” —Peter Block

Segment three:

  • On entrepreneurship being risk, “One of the gifts of the scientific method is that it teaches us that failure is as valuable as success.” —Peter Block

  • As a leader, “You don’t demand predictability. There is nothing more frightening than predictability.” —Peter Block

  • “If I can’t say no, my ‘yes’ doesn’t mean anything.” —Peter Block

  • On gifts and finding purpose in an organization, “You shouldn’t have to retire to find out what you meant to this place.” —Peter Block

  • “If ever there was a moment when the imposter syndrome came true, it’s in the publishing of a book.” —Peter Block (and his NEW BOOK in the link) https://www.amazon.com/Confronting-Our-Freedom-Accountability-Belonging/dp/139415609X

Segment four:

  • On Peter’s general philosophy on solving problems “I don’t want to argue against problem solving. I just don’t want it to define who I am.”

  • “The enemy of aliveness is likemindedness.” —Peter Block 

  • On the obscenity of corporate culture, Peter Block says (with enthusiasm), “To leave a meeting without a list! My God. You can go to hell for leaving a meeting without a list.”

  • “As soon as you take something to scale, you force it to be the same no matter where it goes.” —Peter Block

  • A big THANK YOU to Peter Block for joining us today. Please check out Designed Learning at @dl_global and his new book https://www.amazon.com/Confronting-Our-Freedom-Accountability-Belonging/dp/139415609X

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #444: The ESG Illusion

Another deep dive into the perils of ESG. This is based on Vivek Ramaswamy's latest book, Capitalist Punishment: How Wall Street Is Using Your Money to Create a Country You Didn't Vote For. Ed and Ron will provide the main points from this critical look at ESG. If you've wondered how FTX can achieve a higher score on its "G" (Governance) than did Exxon-Mobil, you won't want to miss this show.

Use these show notes to follow along with the audio.

Segment one:

  • Have you read Capitalist Punishment yet by Vivek Ramaswamy yet? One of the things Ron and Ed loved about the book is that Vivek backs it up with evidence and examples from multiple sources. https://www.amazon.com/Capitalist-Punishment-Street-Create-Country/dp/0063337754 

  • Greenwashing is fraudulent. The SEC has sued several investment firms for greenwashing. Green SMUGGLING occurs when a non-ESG fund smuggles ESG policies into their investment practices.

  • The levels of complexity in the book Capitalist Punishment make talking about the topic difficult. It’s not 2D or 3-dimensional but rather a series of tentacles that provide for an intense level of complexity. However, it is NOT conspiracy theory

  • “ESG is the traffic cop that writes tickets to enforce stakeholder capitalism” —Vivek Ramaswamy https://www.amazon.com/Capitalist-Punishment-Street-Create-Country/dp/0063337754 

  • Both CSR and SRI make no pretenses about maximizing returns but ESG does. ESG claims a higher level of return while solving all of the world’s injustices.

Segment two:

Segment three:

  • We are going to be live at Scaling New Heights in two weeks. If you will be there, check us out on the main stage! #SNH23

  • In China, the E stands for “E”nergy supply, S is all about the “S”uggestion, and G is the most fun. In the US, good “G”overnance means not being owned by a single, autocratic dictator. (Are we banned in China yet?)

  • Regarding ESG, “This is politics. It belongs in the political realm. It doesn’t belong in the C-suite. Nobody elected Larry Fink.” —Ron Baker

  • What we commonly hear is, “When the accountants get ahold of ESG they will be able to put standards in place.” Ron and Ed would like to know, “Based on what?” It’s a genuine question to the community.

  • Sam Bankman-Fried was able to get FTX a higher ESG score than Exxon-Mobil. 

Segment four:

  • Great background on ESG from the show today. What can you do? Start asking questions of your money managers and investment funds.

  • Based on the book Capitalist Punishment by Vivek Ramaswamy, funds are pouring out of ESG. The trend is shifting based on investment activity. https://www.amazon.com/Capitalist-Punishment-Street-Create-Country/dp/0063337754 

  • “At least with David Copperfield making the Statue of Liberty disappear, he is entertaining me. [The ESG Illusion] is not entertaining me.” —Ron Baker

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits.