Episode #537: One of Our Own — Second interview with Mark Koziel

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We are thrilled to welcome Mark Koziel, CPA, CGMA, as our guest on this episode of The Soul of Enterprise. Mark has recently been appointed as the President and CEO of the American Institute of CPAs (AICPA) and the Association of International Certified Professional Accountants, effective January 2025. Prior to this role, he served as the President and CEO of Allinial Global, an association of independent accounting and advisory firms. With over 25 years of experience in accounting and leadership, Mark has been a consistent advocate for the profession, bringing a global perspective to the evolving landscape of accounting and finance.

In this episode, we delve into Mark’s vision for the future of the accounting profession, discussing the challenges and opportunities that lie ahead. We explore his journey from public accounting to leading major professional organizations, and how his experiences have shaped his perspectives on leadership, innovation, and the role of accountants in today’s dynamic business environment.

SHOW NOTES

Segment one

• “As a profession we just need to show up and be more positive about who we are. It is the greatest profession in the world.” —Mark Koziel, President of AICPA

• YES — Creating a sense of community is one of the most consistent insights Mark has heard while traveling and listening to AICPA members.

• Mentioned on the show today: Other Comprehensive Basis of Accounting (OCBOA) is a non-GAAP accounting protocol used to generate financial statements. OCBAOA examples include the income tax basis of accounting, the cash basis of accounting, and the modified cash basis of accounting. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/o/other-comprehensive-basis-of-accounting.asp 

• Also mentioned today: SSARS No. 21 is a Statement on Standards for Accounting and Review Services issued by the AICPA, and it addresses the preparation of financial statements. https://www.aicpa-cima.com/resources/download/aicpa-ssarss-currently-effective 

• “Wouldn’t it be great—Ron and Ed—if we could stop talking about hours as being a gauge of success?” —Mark Koziel

Segment two

• “Please think with us, not like us” is a great phrase that Mark uses and attributes to Ron.

• Many of us here at The Soul of Enterprise are big fans of the TV show “Ted Lasso”. It was great to hear Mark quote Ted (and attribute the quote to Walt Whitman): “Be curious, not judgmental”

• “Technology investments and AI — they should be natural pushes into us doing this because if it’s not and we still come back to this ‘hours times rate’ thing, we’re going to be in trouble.” —Mark Koziel

• TIL Tom Hood started “Finance of the Future” which has become a community of CFOs from some of the largest companies in the United States 

Segment three

• “Show me a firms’s dashboard and I’ll tell you about its culture.” —Ron Baker

• “Overall we can’t keep using [timesheets] as our ultimate measure of value […]. It’s going to be a race to the bottom.” —Mark Koziel

• Regarding burnout in the accounting industry: “If I’m driven by family values and being with family, I’m probably going to want to work less.” —Mark Koziel

• “The burnout diagnosis seems to put the blame on the person rather than the system. And I think that it’s the system that eats the young.” —Ron Baker

Segment four

• It’s much too complex for a tweet, but you need to listen to segment four of the show today when Ed asked Mark about CPE, hours, and how to address the obvious issues.

• You get all of your stuff at the end of the year. W-2. 1099s from a 401k. And so on. There has to be a ChatGPT thing where I just drop and drag all of my PDF files that I have and say, “produce a tax return for me”. Does this already exist?

• A big THANK YOU to Mark Koziel for joining us today! https://www.aicpa-cima.com/news/article/mark-koziel-new-aicpa-cima-ceo 

• Bonus note (reference by Ed during the show): Jamey Johnson singing “The Dollar” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlnYH5Da32A

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #536: Crossing the Threshold — A New Chapter Begins

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Ron and Ed unveil their bold new venture—THRESHOLD. In this episode, they share the vision behind the company, why it matters now, and how it aims to challenge the status quo in advisory and consulting. THRESHOLD is more than a brand—it’s a mindset shift for professionals ready to think beyond billable hours and transactional models. If you’re looking for transformation, not just iteration, this is your call to cross the threshold with us.

SHOW NOTES

Segment one

• The root of the transformation for Ron and Ed started with a book published in 1999. “The Experience Economy: Work Is Theater & Every Business a Stage” by Joe Pine and James Gilmore https://www.amazon.com/Experience-Economy-Theater-Every-Business/dp/0875848192 

• The progression of economic value, as articulated by Pine and Gilmore, outlines how value is created over time, moving from commodities to goods, services, and finally to experiences and transformations. More here: https://worldxo.org/progressioneconomicvalue/ 

• Regarding the progression of economic value: “Recall the Progression of Economic Value given in Chapter 1 and how each higher level of offering is built atop the one below it. Or, to say it differently, each successive offering subsumes the ones below it.” From Joe Pine’s substack at https://transformationsbook.substack.com/p/levels-of-experiences-part-one 

• This is the graph of the progression of economic value referenced by Ron and Ed today on the show (credit to https://worldxo.org/progressioneconomicvalue/)

Segment two

• In the context of the conversation today, initially people moved to goods and services to experiences (think Disneyworld and concerts). Experiences are different because customers pay the business money to spend time with the business. Paying to get into the Disney park, for example.

• An experience can also be something that is not delivered at a particular spot. Virtual reality, home services, and so, are all great examples. The third edition of The Experience Economy lays out different types of experiences that are all memorable to the individual. https://www.amazon.com/Experience-Economy-New-Preface-Authors/dp/1633697975/ 

• For a transformation to be successful it has to be aspirational in the customer’s mind. The customer is the product (not in a bad way). They are the ones changing so they need to ASPIRE to be the end result of the transformation. 

• Joe Pine is now working on a new book called “The Transformation Economy”. As a part of the book, he has published his journey on substack and you can find it here: https://transformationsbook.substack.com/ 

Segment three

• Ron and Ed referenced this previous show today: Episode #518: Trends in the Transformation Economy with Christophe Jauquet https://www.thesoulofenterprise.com/518 

• Ron reference Eataly earlier on the show. You can buy commodities there like pasta and olive oil. You can buy good there as well. In the services space, they have a cafe and restaurants. Now how does Eataly provide a transformation? They have cooking classes. https://www.eataly.com 

• In one of his white papers, Joe Pine, co-author of the Experience Economy book, discussed how time is the key distinction between services and experiences in the Progression of Economic Value. Joe says, "Services are about time well saved while experiences are about time well spent. https://whitehutchinson.com/news/lenews/2022/december/article110.shtml 

Segment four

• Summarized from Joe Pine: When you really look at customer aspirations, those aspirations revolve around being healthy, wealthy, and wiser. What customers really want is health and well being, wisdom and understanding, wealth and prosperity, purpose and meaning.

• These (see above) are universal aspirations. The great part about customers’ desire to be healthier, wealthier, and wiser is that you do not need to gin up demand! Who doesn’t want this?

• Thank you for joining us today. There is a complimentary level available for Threshold. It is the Foundation membership available at this link: https://thresholdnow.com/join 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #535: Juche for Dummies — Why Self-Sufficiency Sucks

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Ron and Ed break down the latest tariff policies of President Donald Trump, offering a free market critique of its implications. They explore how tariffs function as hidden taxes on consumers, challenge the idea of using protectionism as economic strategy, and examine the historical consequences of similar policies.

SHOW NOTES

Segment one

• Literally "subject idea" Juche incorporates the historical materialist ideas of Marxism–Leninism but also strongly emphasizes the individual, the nation state, and national sovereignty. Juche posits that a country will prosper once it has become self-reliant by achieving political, economic, and military independence. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juche 

• Staying with the theme of Juche: If self-suffienciency worked, North Korea would be Monaco.

• Having Trump Derangement Syndrome (when it comes to tariffs) means you are economically LITERATE. Congratulations.

• “You couldn’t fill a Mini Cooper with economists who agree with tariffs. You just couldn’t.” —Ron Baker

• Ed referenced episode 76, Lessons from the Trading Game, on the show today. Here is the link https://www.thesoulofenterprise.com/76 

Segment two

• “In every country it always is and must be the interest of the great body of the people to buy whatever they want of those who sell it cheapest. The proposition is so very manifest, that it seems ridiculous to take any pains to prove it; nor could it ever have been called in question, had not the interested sophistry of merchants and manufacturers confounded the common-sense of mankind.” —Adam Smith, 1776, The Wealth of Nations

• On Juche for Dummies, “I’m sure we are at a trade deficit with some country that’s importing bananas to us. And we then slap a 10% tariff on them because we want bananas?” —Ed Kless

• Referenced on the show today: Economics in One Lesson — The Shortest and Surest Way to Understand Basic Economics by Henry Hazlitt https://www.amazon.com/Economics-One-Lesson-Shortest-Understand/dp/0517548232 

• NAFTA lost 1 million jobs for the US in its first 20 years between 1994 and 2014. That means it took NAFTA two decades to kill as many jobs as we turn naturally IN 18 DAYS.

Segment three

• “In general international deficits and surpluses have had virtually no correlation with the performance of most nation’s economies.” —Thomas Sowell in Basic Economics https://www.amazon.com/Basic-Economics-Thomas-Sowell/dp/0465060730

• “Read My Lips: Tariffs Are Taxes” by Kevin Williamson https://thedispatch.com/article/trump-tariffs-taxes-housing-prices-lumber/ 

• From the official government website, the Harmonized Tariff Schedule sets out the tariff rates and statistical categories for all merchandise imported into the United States. https://hts.usitc.gov/ 

Segment four

• A great joke from Ron on the show today, “If exports are great and imports are bad then, like Bastiat said, we should sink all the ships at sea.”

• Regarding tariffs and current economic “policy”: All of this boils down to zero sum game thinking, something we have railed against at The Soul of Enterprise for the entirety of our existence.

• Those penguins we mentioned today? Yeah, that’s a real thing. Here’s the article titled “No economy is safe from Trump’s tariffs, even non-economies” https://sherwood.news/world/no-economy-safe-trumps-tariffs-even-non-economies-heard-island/ 

• From Jeffrey Blehar at National Review, “So it is with President Donald Trump who — convinced of his own superior intellect — has crowbarred open a newly delivered crate of ACME Trade Policy, unboxed Peter Navarro circa 1996, and strapped on his goggles and rocket shoes to catch that elusive, slippery trade deficit once and for all.” https://www.nationalreview.com/carnival-of-fools/trumps-cartoon-physics-takes-america-off-the-cliff/ 

• Wile E. Coyote: Genius https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PufFA8kDWFk 

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits. 

Episode #534: Milton’s Mandate — The Market, Morality, and Money

NEW SHOW FEATURE: We are now LIVE streaming our shows. Want to join us live? Just click this link every Friday at 3pm ET / 12pm PT.

In this episode, Ron and Ed dive into one of the most influential and debated essays in business and economic thought: Milton Friedman’s The Social Responsibility of Business Is to Increase Its Profits. Published in The New York Times in 1970, Friedman’s argument that businesses should focus solely on maximizing shareholder value while operating within the law sparked decades of debate about corporate ethics, stakeholder capitalism, and the role of business in society.

Ron and Ed will unpack Friedman’s perspective, discuss its implications for modern businesses, and explore how it contrasts with contemporary views on corporate social responsibility (CSR) and ESG (Environmental, Social, and Governance) initiatives. Is Friedman’s argument still valid in today’s world, or has the definition of corporate responsibility evolved? Tune in for an insightful discussion on one of the most enduring ideas in free-market economics.

📖 Read Friedman’s original essay: The New York Times

SHOW NOTES

Segment one

• Originally published on Sept 13, 1970, the basis of our show today is Milton Friedman’s article “The Social Responsibility of Business Is to Increase Its Profits” https://www.nytimes.com/1970/09/13/archives/a-friedman-doctrine-the-social-responsibility-of-business-is-to.html?unlocked_article_code=1.9E4.8Fy6.8Z-P1t4lzAfk&smid=url-share 

• “Businessmen who talk this way (about a social conscience) are unwitting puppets of the intellectual forces that have been undermining the basis of a free society these past decades.” —Milton Friedman

• “What does it mean to say that “business” has responsibilities? Only people can have responsibilities.” —Milton Friedman in 1970 https://www.nytimes.com/1970/09/13/archives/a-friedman-doctrine-the-social-responsibility-of-business-is-to.html?unlocked_article_code=1.9E4.8Fy6.8Z-P1t4lzAfk&smid=url-share 

• A common quote criticizing capitalism, attributed to Herbert Hoover, is: "The only trouble with capitalism is capitalists; they're too damned greedy."

Segment two

• Social responsibilities fall on the individual and not the organization based on Milton Friedman’s 1970 article. Check the image for the details of his writing.

• Friedman could have been more clear in his article and here is part of the section that requires possibly reading it more than once. Link to the full article: https://www.nytimes.com/1970/09/13/archives/a-friedman-doctrine-the-social-responsibility-of-business-is-to.html?unlocked_article_code=1.9E4.8Fy6.8Z-P1t4lzAfk&smid=url-share 

• “What does it mean to say that the corporate executive has a ‘social responsibility’ in his capacity as businessman? If this statement is not pure rhetoric, it must mean that he is to act in some way that is not in the interest of his employers.” —Milton Friedman in 1970 https://www.nytimes.com/1970/09/13/archives/a-friedman-doctrine-the-social-responsibility-of-business-is-to.html?unlocked_article_code=1.9E4.8Fy6.8Z-P1t4lzAfk&smid=url-share 

• “…when the corporate executive imposes taxes and spends the proceeds for ‘social’ purposes. He becomes in effect a public employe, a civil servant, even though he remains in name an employe of private enterprise.” —Milton Friedman

Segment three

• Segment three of the show today starts with a lengthy section from Friedman’s Doctrine beginning with, “ON the grounds of consequences, can the corporate executive in fact discharge his alleged ‘social responsibilities’? On the one hand, suppose he could get away with spending the stockholders’ or customers’ or employes’ money. How is he to know how to spend it?” https://www.nytimes.com/1970/09/13/archives/a-friedman-doctrine-the-social-responsibility-of-business-is-to.html?unlocked_article_code=1.9E4.8Fy6.8Z-P1t4lzAfk&smid=url-share 

• 🤣 🤣 🤣 “We thus have the ironic phenomenon that union leaders—at least in the U.S. —have objected to Government interference with the market far more consistently and courageously than have business leaders.” —Milton Friedman

• “In a free society, it is hard for ‘good’ people to do ‘good,’ but that is a small price to pay for making it hard for ‘evil’ people to do ‘evil,’ especially since one man's good is anther's evil.” —Milton Friedman in 1970

• “So in a way, it’s a marketing expense, which we’ve always accused CSR of being.” —Ron Baker and Ed Kless on corporate social responsibility 

Segment four

• “[Businessmen] are capable of being extremely far‐sighted and clear‐headed in matters that are internal to their businesses. They are incredibly short sighted and muddle‐headed in matters that are outside their businesses but affect the possible survival of business in general.” —Milton Friedman https://www.nytimes.com/1970/09/13/archives/a-friedman-doctrine-the-social-responsibility-of-business-is-to.html?unlocked_article_code=1.9E4.8Fy6.8Z-P1t4lzAfk&smid=url-share 

• Here is the conclusion to Friedman’s Doctrine from 1970: But the doctrine of “social responsibility” taken seriously would extend the scope of the political mechanism to every human activity. It does not differ in philosophy from the most explicitly collectivist doctrine. It differs only by professing to believe that collectivist ends can be attained without collectivist means. That is why, in my book “Capitalism and Freedom,” I have called it a “fundamentally subversive doctrine” in a free society, and have said that in such a society, “there is one and only one social responsibility of business—to use its resources and engage in activities designed to increase its profits so long as it stays within the rules of the game, which is to say, engages in open and free competition without deception or fraud.”

Bonus Content is Available As Well

Did you know that each week after our live show, Ron and Ed take to the microphone for a bonus show? Typically, this bonus show is an extension of the live show topic (sometimes even with the same guest) and a few other pieces of news, current events, or things that have caught our attention.

Click the “FANATIC” image to learn more about pricing and member benefits.